lizard
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Post by lizard on May 13, 2019 2:58:30 GMT
I think it is dissappointing for Emilia Clarke to be turned into the mad villain after all these years of being the magical hero.
Disappointing. The Brienne actress told it like it is.
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Post by waywyrd on May 13, 2019 3:10:26 GMT
The best part of the episode was CleganeBowl. I hated to see Sandor go out like that, but that was probably the best way for that to end, I guess. Cersei slipping past them before they went at each other made me laugh. Nice to see that creepy Qyburn get squashed on a rock, too. And good riddance to that pig Euron. NOT happy about Cersei and Jaime being taken out by a crumbling building - what a letdown! And Dany...damn. I know they've been building up to it, but she totally went Mad Queen. I was rather enjoying Drogon blasting Euron's fleet to bits, and that gate blowing open was awesome. Then Cersei's army said screw this and laid their weapons down, but Dany just wouldn't stop. It was sad to see her ruin that city and kill all those people. And why did the northern army all of a sudden turn into raping pillagers? WTF. You chose the wrong side, Tyrion. I hate that he ratted out Varys. I know Jon won't be able to forgive all the carnage, but what will he do? And where is Arya off to? I wish there were a few more episodes, this all feels so rushed.
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Post by FireWoman on May 13, 2019 4:03:18 GMT
I called Dany going Mad Queen long ago.. but it was awful to see.
I hope that Arya was riding off to Gendry, heh.
I must say with an amazing 7 seasons prior this season is a train wreck in comparison. Disappointing to say the least, plot lines out of wack, subpar writing, and yes the time line is tooooo rushed to really do the show itself justice. At this point I am pot committed and will finish out the show, but it has all be a real let down of a season with the only shining point, albeit dark in its own right, the battle of Winterfell. CleganeBowl was even meh for me even if it was the best part of this episode. To see characters go out the way they did didn't do them justice either, Cersei for all her evilness got off light. Varys' death was anticlimactic too. At this point, for me at least, this season has ruined the legacy of this show but who to blame? GRRM for not finishing the books? D&D for their interpretation of what should have been? Again, all I can say is meh.
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Post by Critical on May 13, 2019 5:08:14 GMT
Well, so Dany needs to die. Will the not-so-happy ending be Jon on the throne, but only after he kills Dany, who devolves completely into the Mad Queen? Some articles are listing Jaime and Cersei among the dead, but I refuse to believe they're dead until we see the bodies. I can't believe they'd just kill them off like that. At least Cersei needs to survive to be killed in a more satisfying manner. If that's how they killed off those two really important characters, then that sucks. What a lazy ending for them. I guess we should have predicted that the winner of Cleganebowl would be no one. Touching to have Arya call out to Sandor and that was a sweet moment that they had in parting. Varys went out the way a lot of us predicted. Kind of a bummer, but not surprising. At this point, I don't think Dany can be redeemed. The only two ways I can see this ending (which means it will end a third way ) is that Dany spirals even more, kills all of those who "betrayed" her and sits on the Iron Throne as the incarnation of her crazy father or (and this is the scenario I prefer), Jon (or maybe Arya!) mercy kills her and ends up, reluctantly, on the throne himself. We still have to catch up with the crowd at Winterfell. What role, if any, will Gendry play? I need to see so many of those characters - Tormund, Brienne, Sansa, Bran, etc. again before the end. I don't know how they will wrap all of this up in 82 minutes? They absolutely could (and probably should) have done more episodes this season. These past few episodes felt very rushed. Like others, I wasn't thrilled with this episode, but the finale can redeem things. I'm starting to doubt that will happen. At this point, it feels like episode 3 will stand as the high point of the season I worried that the stuff at the end with Arya and the horse was her in the afterlife or something. It had such a dreamy quality to it that I thought she might be unconscious or dead.
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Post by Critical on May 13, 2019 8:36:58 GMT
Okay, this may be the first time I've found reliable spoilers about the season. This came from a few of the crew members on the final season. Some of this was posted a while ago and many spoilers posted by them for the first five episodes were right on. I looked at these spoilers because after tonight I'm feeling, well, less invested in the ending. Don't click if you don't want to know (or maybe know). Not giving anything away, but there is a strong possibility that some of the cast members were right: they filmed multiple endings and had a few "decoy shoots" to throw people off. Not sure how I feel about it yet, but here it is....
https://www.reddit.com/r/freefolk/comments/bkc8xd/compilation_of_spoilers_for_got_episodes_46/
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lizard
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Post by lizard on May 13, 2019 9:34:26 GMT
Thank you for posting that Critical. The heroes ended up with the short end of the stick. I am disappointed for Kit too. {Spoiler} Bran said he wasn't interested in being the Lord of Winterfell. He mostly lives in the past. So I doubt he is connected enough to the present to want to be a ruler. Jon was once an elected ruler. He could be again if Westeros residents see Jon as a savior. HBO with their prequels has a lot on the line.
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lizard
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Post by lizard on May 13, 2019 13:40:24 GMT
Missandei was digitally added to a scene to prevent spoiling.
I believe they shot the scene with Bran and will digitally insert Jon in.
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Post by waywyrd on May 13, 2019 13:59:26 GMT
I'm going to try and restrain myself and not click on that spoiler link. I do think Jaime and Cersei are dead, and what a lame ass death it was. Two major, major characters for all these years and they get squashed by a falling building. The writers blew it on that one. And now that they've made Dany an unlikable lunatic - after many seasons of her being a kind, just leader - I don't think there's any way she'll sit on the throne. If there's even a throne left. Jon or Arya will have to take Dany out, and I wouldn't mind Jon on the throne even though he doesn't want it. If Tyrion makes it out alive, I'll be shocked. I've read several theories on Arya's Super Convenient Horse - the one I like best is that Bran warged into the animal to help her out. Hey, he's got to do something useful for a change. Of course, with the lazy writing this season, it's probably just some random horse.
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Post by Gutmutter on May 13, 2019 14:44:48 GMT
I’ll take that theory and run with it. Go Bran! I want to know the direction of Arya’s arc now that she’s chosen life over death. Sandor tackling his brother into an inferno was the hero’s way to go, given his aversion to fire. Poor Dany. No redemption now. I guess Jon has to accept the weight of ruling whether he wants to or not. If Dany is killed, will her dragon accept Jon as a substitute? Will Tyrion be Hand to Jon? I think Cersei and Jaime being crushed by the trappings of their realm is a fitting metaphor, but it doesn’t fulfill the prophecy. I still want an epilogue with Brienne surrounded by her brood of giant gingers (and one blonde? 😘) and Sam Tarley smoking a pipe and telling stories to his grandkids.
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ccl
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Post by ccl on May 13, 2019 16:56:57 GMT
Got to disagree with Dany always being kind and just...yes, she has definitely done good (breaker of chains etc.) but she has always had a ruthless and power-hungry streak. Her burning down Kings Landing did not surprise (disappoint) me. I did always hope she would give up her dogged pursuit of Westeros and instead find her house with the red door and the lemon tree, but alas, she chose to cross the narrow sea.
Jaime and Cersei’s end was rather meh but watch them somehow survived a building collapsing on them. Which will lead to me rolling my eyes next week if that happens.
Sandor’s words set Arya on a new path. I think the horrors of war did as well - a lot different than battling someone one-on-one, or stealing a face and poisoning people. So will she turn her back completely on being an assassin? Maybe return to Gendry?
I think next week will have Jon killing Dany. I don’t think he will rule though, I think he will return North. So who will sit on the throne? Maybe this means the end of the Seven Kingdoms and they will become separate entities?
I hope they show Winterfell next week. I need more of Sansa, Brienne and Sam. Maybe they’ll show up in Kings Landing instead though.
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Post by waywyrd on May 13, 2019 17:57:57 GMT
I agree that Dany has always been ruthless and power hungry, but she's never been flat out evil. She had empathy, and tried to do good even if she didn't go about it in the best way. She was impulsive at times, wanting to act out of anger...but she usually listened to her advisers, who talked her down. Now, she refuses to listen to anyone. I just have a hard time understanding how a character who locked her dragons up after they killed one child decides to vaporize an entire city for no good reason. The same city of people that Jaime basically saved from her own father.
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lizard
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Post by lizard on May 13, 2019 17:58:40 GMT
Varys told the kitchen girl where there is great risk there is great reward. She could poison Dany unexpectedly. That would be the most painless transition. Aegon II was poisoned in a painless transition.
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Post by Amy Lee on May 13, 2019 18:05:53 GMT
It would be a disservice to the fans to not give them a good ending. Otherwise, what's the point? It really bugs that they rushed this last season as well.
It's not too much to ask for them to finish strong.
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Post by Critical on May 13, 2019 19:34:53 GMT
Just a reminder to PLEASE use spoiler tags if discussing things that really could reveal the ending (not just "I think this person will die/end up on the IT, etc."). After 8 seasons, if someone wants to remain unspoiled, they deserve that. The spoiler button is at the far right of the line of buttons on every Create Post screen.Yeah, I don't think anyone is necessarily surprised at Dany's turn. What's surprising is the speed at which it's all happening. With the success of this show, HBO told D&D they could have whatever they needed for this final season. THEY were the ones who decided on only 6 episodes. Maybe if they'd done 10 or even 8, they could have done more justice to the story and given the fans something better instead of this full tilt careening towards the end. Funny that some complained early in the season that they weren't getting to the action quickly enough .
Yes, there were clues along the way - even in season 1 (her reaction to Viserys' death, especially) - of what would happen with Dany, but the audience needs more than a few glowering looks and references to the Mad King. She's been pretty ruthless over the years and seemingly happy to burn her enemies alive. The burning of Randyll and Dickon Tarly was a pretty big turning point, IMO. Still, ten minutes of her being locked in her room and not brushing her hair or eating is not enough.
I read an interview last night with Conleth Hill and he was pretty unhappy about the lack of anything Varys had to do over the last few seasons. He actually pointed to the lack of source material available for these final seasons as a problem. I have to agree. Varys was such a great character and they wasted him in seasons 7 and 8. He sort of showed up to deliver a little piece of news and then disappear. If Cersei and Jaime are truly dead, then what a lazy ending for them. I don't care about the "they left the world the same way they came in - together" nonsense. We've all been waiting for YEARS for Maggy's prophesy to play out and see her murdered at the hands of her little brother and then....a freaking building falls on her? Like the Wicked Witch of the West? UGH
I thought for sure this show would take every award at the Emmys this year. Not really feeling that way now
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ccl
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Post by ccl on May 13, 2019 20:10:46 GMT
Pretty much “yeah that” to your entire post. I really wish that they would have taken more time/episodes. With regards to Dany, I think maybe I am mixing in hints of her “mad Queen” elements from the books where so much more time - pages - were spent on things. And the books have stuff the show hasn’t touched on, or even ignored or disregarded in the end, like the prophecy regarding Cersei’s death. I mean, you can make mad leaps...Cersei died at the hands of her little brother because he was responsible for helping Dany get into Westeros, and Dany was the one who burned down the Keep, so ipso facto...but, yeah, it’s a major stretch. Speaking of, I wish GRRM would have - will - finish the books as well. But I guess this is what we are going to get.
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Post by momrek06 on May 14, 2019 16:05:19 GMT
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lizard
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Post by lizard on May 14, 2019 17:57:20 GMT
George RR Martin also forgot that he was suppose to put mad Targaryens in his history of Targaryen book Fire and Blood (if he was so committed to Targaryen madness). He only had like a 100 Targaryens or more. He could have made one of them mad.
Given that George RR Martin knows that he had problems in his book. He said he killed off one of his characters that would have been essential for finishing the book properly. He forgets what color eyes his characters have. He had two incompatible components: Jaimie's love for Cersai; Jaimie wanting to die in the arms of the woman he loves; and the accurate witch saying Cersai is killed by the younger brother. D and D dismissed a component there. They could have dismissed the madness component and kept the fact that Dany doesn't get the iron throne. They could have kept some vengeance burning without madness.
They got us to watch because Dany was a hero. It would take more than a season to undo that. An extra 5 or 10 years to get Dani "mad" is not congruous with the rest of the story--Arya being separated from her family and brother for 10 years already. Frankly, Arya (little kill bill) is currently ready to take care of Cersai.
Season 8 DVD won't be worth buying. Game of Thrones advertising for season 8 and the upcoming prequel is "it wasn't what you thought, and everything good and bad is upside down." Lame
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Post by Arielflies on May 14, 2019 19:59:17 GMT
I'm so sorry all of you have crashed and burned along with this final season. I don't pay for HBO and haven't watched the DVDs, but I read a good part of the first book (Fire and Ice) and have kept up with your play by play over the years. Even I was expecting a satisfying ending, not what you describe as a poof-dud of emotions.
My thoughts and prayers are with you as you navigate the final episode on Sunday.
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Post by FireWoman on May 14, 2019 22:33:46 GMT
I'm so sorry all of you have crashed and burned along with this final season. I don't pay for HBO and haven't watched the DVDs, but I read a good part of the first book (Fire and Ice) and have kept up with your play by play over the years. Even I was expecting a satisfying ending, not what you describe as a poof-dud of emotions. My thoughts and prayers are with you as you navigate the final episode on Sunday. LOL, thanks I was ok with everyone dying, crying my eyes out, being sad for that all the death that would happen.. but at least give them good send offs, make a death MEAN SOMETHING, let the character arc playout not fizzle. Sigh, there are a million things I can say about this season and not many are good. I had no problem with Dany being Mad, as I have said it is in her DNA and I expected it, but don't make it just a week long build up. (same with Greyworm who was able to be so void of emotion as an Unsullied snaps with bells too?!?!) Subtle hints are lost on most people, and there were so many ways they could have played it out to at least make it more believable. We all hated Cersei, we had 7 seasons of building to that her.. but we didn't want to see her go out like Omarosa on the Apprentice... Dany's decent, whereas very much expected for me had no arc to it.
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Post by Critical on May 15, 2019 1:10:17 GMT
As disappointing as episode 5 was narratively (in what universe does Euron freaking Greyjoy get a "better" death than Cersei and Jaime?), it was still visually stunning. Those shots of the Cleganes on the stairs with Drogon flying overhead were amazing.
After so many years, it's frustrating that D&D couldn't give fans the final season they and the series itself deserved. Did they just get too arrogant and believed they could do it in that few episodes or did they just want to be done? I mean, Benioff is an accomplished fiction writer, but he's no GRRM when it comes to complicated plots developed over decades.
For me, the emotional high of the season was Arya killing the Night King. It's felt like all downhill from there.
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Post by momrek06 on May 15, 2019 2:51:44 GMT
As disappointing as episode 5 was narratively (in what universe does Euron freaking Greyjoy get a "better" death than Cersei and Jaime?), it was still visually stunning. Those shots of the Cleganes on the stairs with Drogon flying overhead were amazing.
After so many years, it's frustrating that D&D couldn't give fans the final season they and the series itself deserved. Did they just get too arrogant and believed they could do it in that few episodes or did they just want to be done? I mean, Benioff is an accomplished fiction writer, but he's no GRRM when it comes to complicated plots developed over decades.
For me, the emotional high of the season was Arya killing the Night King. It's felt like all downhill from there.
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Totally agree with you Critical. While I am a big fan of SPOILERS .... this final season of GOT I have chosen to read NO spoilers and have stayed away from all SM on Sunday eve. Living in California and coming from the east coast, I have tons of family and friends that take to all kinds of SM while viewing and I am 3 hours behind them. Watching Arya was THRILLING.......seeing her JUMP from basically out of no where to kill the NK was awesome!!!!!
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Post by Critical on May 15, 2019 8:09:59 GMT
^^^ I'm in CA too, but I watch at the same time as the East coast. The HBOE channel airs the show at 6pm Pacific.
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lizard
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Post by lizard on May 15, 2019 8:20:50 GMT
There wasn't snow in the battle, but there is snow in the episode 6 preview. I believe it is real snow and not ash. No snow when people are running around on the streets; but Arya is watching now and covered in it. Weird. foreBoding of the last of bad perhaps??? I am in Florida. I have only seen freak snow twice in my 54 years of age. I am one of the first watchers of all Star Wars movies. But with all this, I will treat the D and D parts like other movies. I will read rotten tomatoes before I step foot in there. {Spoiler Skywalker Returns in Dec 2019} I hope Hayden Christensen comes back to life. Somewhere it looks like they are implying that emperor Palpatine does.
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Post by waywyrd on May 15, 2019 11:34:19 GMT
Is that snow? I thought it was ash, a reference to Dany saying last season that she didn't come there to be the "Queen of Ashes." How's that working out, Dany? D & D on a Star Wars film? Oh, brother. They'd better not screw that up, too.
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Post by momrek06 on May 15, 2019 15:41:59 GMT
^^^ I'm in CA too, but I watch at the same time as the East coast. The HBOE channel airs the show at 6pm Pacific. WHATTTTT? REALLLLLLLLLY! ONE episode left after watching 8 seasons and I am justing finding this out NOW!!!!!
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Post by momrek06 on May 15, 2019 15:43:15 GMT
There wasn't snow in the battle, but there is snow in the episode 6 preview. I believe it is real snow and not ash. No snow when people are running around on the streets; but Arya is watching now and covered in it. Weird. foreBoding of the last of bad perhaps??? I am in Florida. I have only seen freak snow twice in my 54 years of age. I am one of the first watchers of all Star Wars movies. But with all this, I will treat the D and D parts like other movies. I will read rotten tomatoes before I step foot in there. {Spoiler Skywalker Returns in Dec 2019} I hope Hayden Christensen comes back to life. Somewhere it looks like they are implying that emperor Palpatine does. lizard ..... I just saw the Trailer when I was at the movies Saturday ...... it looks soooooooo good!!!!!!!! RE: SNOW .... what is "freak" snow? As far as the REAL thing ..... nope, hated it my whole life living EAST.
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lizard
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Post by lizard on May 16, 2019 0:06:30 GMT
We don't usually get snow and we are not equipped to drive in it. Once we were iced in for a week with schools shut down. (Freak snow--snow that we don't usually get)
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Post by momrek06 on May 16, 2019 2:33:49 GMT
We don't usually get snow and we are not equipped to drive in it. Once we were iced in for a week with schools shut down. (Freak snow--snow that we don't usually get)Oh ok lizard .... well IMHO I hope to NEVER have to deal with it again .... I hate and loathe SNOW!!!!!
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Post by Critical on May 16, 2019 6:03:41 GMT
^^^ I'm in CA too, but I watch at the same time as the East coast. The HBOE channel airs the show at 6pm Pacific. WHATTTTT? REALLLLLLLLLY! ONE episode left after watching 8 seasons and I am justing finding this out NOW!!!!! It probably depends on what cable service you have, but Comcast has like 8 or 9 HBO channels. Unfortunately only one is in HD AND in English, but I'd rather see GOT as soon as possible, so I watch it at 6pm Pacific in SD and then watch it again in HD at 9:00. I'm hopeful that Comcast will increase the number of HD channels they offer. It's a bummer to watch a show like GOT in SD.
I can't believe this will all be over in just a few days. I'm sad, but also sort of relieved. This season has been a bit of a disappointment, especially the last two episodes. I truly hope GRRM finishes the series so we'll know how it was meant to be done.
I have to think that we've seen most of the major deaths this season. I don't think the finale is going to be a massacre or anything. I think we all figure Dany will die, I think by Jon's hands when he realizes she's gone full Mad Queen and cannot come back from it. I worry that she'll put Tyrion to death for treason (freeing Jaime) before she's done. That would seriously SUCK. I love him.
Really, as long as the Starks, including Jon survive, I'm good. I think, since most of my other faves - Davos, Brienne, Gendry, Tormund - aren't really in the line of fire so-to-speak, they're probably safe.
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lizard
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Post by lizard on May 16, 2019 9:34:01 GMT
I was so frustrated with Tyrion seeing Jaimie. I wasn't listening to is last bye bye speech--That he was a very good brother and saved him since he was a child. I can say that is touching.
No I hope she does not get Tyrion. Arya had that what look on her face. Arya might get Dany.
I was ok with some twists and ends some of the Targaryens because they were not the end all be all. But Danerys is my queen. That is not a cool twist. That is just a twist.
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