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Post by FannyMare on Oct 21, 2020 14:33:17 GMT
I'm pretty sure that if Brandon had known more about her, she would have accused him of stalking her. He was not going to win either way. Claire is not going to be happy with any outcome because no man can love her as much as she's loves (is obsessed) with herself. And I'm sorry, I know this show is not known for protecting human dignity and treating people who are on it with respect - but if the roles were reversed and a Bachelor told 10 women on a group date that the losing team for dodgeball had to do a walk of shame naked, he'd be the cause of the show being cancelled. It was NOT okay! Even though most of them (if not all) were in their underwear with black squares. Humiliating men into adoring you is not an acceptable way to date! Were they naked, or did they wear thong underwear. ? I know in the bachelor , they had girls skiing in thong bikini bottoms.. |
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Post by acookertv on Oct 21, 2020 14:42:45 GMT
In a recap I read, it was written as some stripped down and others kept their underwear on. There were a few who the box went away and they were in underwear. So it may have been something where the editing tried to make it seem like more harsh than it was. But it's not okay to manipulate anyone into stripping down on a first date. Seduce them into it and have fun - fine! But Claire's terms of what it takes for a guy to show her he's into her are too much!
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Post by FannyMare on Oct 21, 2020 14:51:55 GMT
In a recap I read, it was written as some stripped down and others kept their underwear on. There were a few who the box went away and they were in underwear. So it may have been something where the editing tried to make it seem like more harsh than it was. But it's not okay to manipulate anyone into stripping down on a first date. Seduce them into it and have fun - fine! But Claire's terms of what it takes for a guy to show her he's into her are too much! Blake was walking away, and the suggestion was, he was naked. But when he sat down, the thong strap was quite evident. I suppose the guys could have said no, if they are sent home, so be it. |
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Post by MissScarlet on Oct 21, 2020 21:58:33 GMT
Well, for better or worse, Episode 2 is done.
My observations are as follows:
Dale - His whole face smiles when he does. I like that. I love a great smile.
I hope Riley is as sincere as he seemed last night. He impressed even me.
Jason's date was one awkward date & too heavy & a real downer. Not first date material.
Brendan - That was odd & awkward. I'll bet that was edited with a lot of it cut out.
I just plain like Blake with the full beard. I'd bet Clare did too. Other than Dale, he's the other one she seems drawn to. If the season had continued, he probably would have made it to F2.
Another I just plain like is Ivan. We didn't see much of him, but I like his looks. He has a "good guy" face. I like "good guy" faces.
As for that awful Strip Dodgeball date, It was just tacky & humiliating & totally unnecessary. No excuse for that at all.
I don't blame Clare. I blame Production & TPTB. What kind of pervert is coming up with a "date" like that?!? And making them stand there & then walk home naked. No, just NO.
As I said last "Bachelorette" with she who will not be named: What's next? Public sex on a park bench with everyone watching? Shooting an explicit Porn Film? .... all in the name of "fun"? NO, that's NOT "fun", nor was this date.
This show has gone from tacky to trashy.
Last but not least, I hate it when an episode previews stuff we don't end up seeing. The Dale bashing by the other guys & subsequent drama was tonight's mislead.
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Post by MFWalkoff on Oct 22, 2020 2:15:25 GMT
So will they show a version without the blackout squares on Disney+?  Highly doubtful.  Why? Donald Duck walks around with no pants on all the time! |
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Post by babbred on Oct 22, 2020 2:49:21 GMT
Dear heavens, was this the worst episode of this franchise ever? 
What the heck happened on that first group date? I could hear the crickets chirping through my television when the guys just sat there and stared at her. I would have been a little miffed, too. So at first I sympathized with Clare. But she should have addressed it right then and there instead of going off and then storming back like that. Good grief. It looked like she was throwing a tantrum.
What was that date with Jason? I felt like I was watching a therapy session with some life coach. BORING. Most...unromantic...date...ever. 
I had mixed feelings about Brandon. Yes, Clare did overreact. Again. But he did kind of set himself up by saying that he heard she was cast and then he rushed out to apply. It kind of implied that he knew something that made him excited about her. And since they recycle leads from past seasons, I would have googled her if I didn't know anything about her. At the very least, I would do so in order to look like the sympathetic guy. "Oh, yes, JPab treated you like a real jerk! I'm not like that!" At the very least, it shouldn't have been hard to find her on social media and find out what he likes, dislikes, etc. Let's just say that whole situation was awkward.
Oh heck no. This reminds me of that previous season where the couple went bungee jumping naked. At least that was just a couple of people, though. Dear heavens. I was raised in the South, and I thought you couldn't get any lower than "tacky" and "trashy". I guess I you can.  Was that Yousef who said he wouldn't have stripped down because he didn't want his daughter to be ashamed of him, and that it was classless? Loved that other guy's reaction. "Not even to your shorts?" No, dude. Because Yousef has some personal dignity and, well, class. I haven't read any spoilers, but I would bet bottom dollar that he's the one who tells her off next week. When I saw those previews last week, I sympathized with Clare. Now I'm rooting for whoever tells her the truth. And good for the guys for walking out.
Mr. Red usually plays his computer game while I watch this show. Occasionally he'll laugh and make a snarky comment. Tonight, though, he was ticked off. He said that was absolutely disgusting what she did to those men on the dodgeball date. He added that Clare is waving red flags all over and that's he's SO glad he didn't meet anyone like her before he met me. Now I'm really rooting for the guys. 
Forgot to add: I loved that scene when Blake crashed the after-party. "Didn't you lose?" Finally, somebody confronts the person trying to steal the lead away! I wish the other guys had carried Blake out. He seems like a nice guy, but that was just rude of him to come back.
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Post by MissGriss on Oct 22, 2020 7:38:04 GMT
I don't feel as harshly toward the Clare/Brandon situation as the rest of you seem to. He told her that he'd been excited to come on because she was the Bachelorette and then he couldn't tell her one thing about her (other than her looks) that had made him want to come. Why was he excited that she was the person he was going to meet? Had he watched her on a show? Had he been impressed with something she had said or the way she had acted when she was announced and Chris interviewed her? It was just weird that he couldn't name one thing about her that had impressed him, which makes me think that he was just blowing smoke or thinking that telling her she was pretty was reason enough. And I'm assuming that's what Clare thought, too.
I did feel bad for him, because he clearly didn't understand what he was doing wrong and was like a deer in the headlights. She could have been kinder about how she blew him off. I didn't like the ice cold affect and impatience with which she talked to him. I can understand feeling impatient, but I do think that as the lead, you have to show a certain amount of graciousness toward the person you're dealing with unless they are being an absolute jerk, which he wasn't. He just wasn't someone who goes as immediately deep as she likes to, which meant they weren't a good match, but that doesn't make him a bad person, and she treated him like he was.
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Post by acookertv on Oct 22, 2020 10:51:59 GMT
But isn't the first impression based on looks what the entire Bachelor nation that Claire has participated in repeatedly based on? I realize that Claire referenced that Dale reached out to her sometime before production started, but even with that, what's the difference between her reaction to him getting out of the limo and having an instant connection to his appearance and Brandon wanting to get to know her better because he liked her looks?
The limo arrivals take up so much time each season on this show because the premise is that attraction starts at first sight. For Bachelor in Paradise, people arrive as they do and have to jump right in because they want attraction to start at first sight. So really Claire was berating Brandon for doing something she's been doing for quite some time!
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Post by babbred on Oct 22, 2020 13:16:19 GMT
I don't feel as harshly toward the Clare/Brandon situation as the rest of you seem to. He told her that he'd been excited to come on because she was the Bachelorette and then he couldn't tell her one thing about her (other than her looks) that had made him want to come. Why was he excited that she was the person he was going to meet? Had he watched her on a show? Had he been impressed with something she had said or the way she had acted when she was announced and Chris interviewed her? It was just weird that he couldn't name one thing about her that had impressed him, which makes me think that he was just blowing smoke or thinking that telling her she was pretty was reason enough. And I'm assuming that's what Clare thought, too. I did feel bad for him, because he clearly didn't understand what he was doing wrong and was like a deer in the headlights. She could have been kinder about how she blew him off. I didn't like the ice cold affect and impatience with which she talked to him. I can understand feeling impatient, but I do think that as the lead, you have to show a certain amount of graciousness toward the person you're dealing with unless they are being an absolute jerk, which he wasn't. He just wasn't someone who goes as immediately deep as she likes to, which meant they weren't a good match, but that doesn't make him a bad person, and she treated him like he was.  As for the limo arrivals, most of the guys did their homework and knew something about Clare beforehand. Again, I am in no way, shape, or form defending her. You nailed it, MissGriss, when you said that as the lead, she should have handled it more graciously. Once again, she came off as a spoiled child. I'm just saying that in her position, I would have been somewhat startled, too. I guess it's just too many seasons of watching this show. I take for granted that everyone who appears on it does so because they at least have a modicum of knowledge about it. I mean, I didn't watch JPab's season, so I didn't know who Clare was she before they announced her as the Bette. I did see her name on the internet, though, back in the spring, so I could have at least told you that people were rooting for her because she was older and had gotten dumped by a jerk. Mostly I just feel sorry for Brandon. Clearly, he was the wrong kind of guy for this show. |
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Post by FannyMare on Oct 22, 2020 14:43:26 GMT
I don't feel as harshly toward the Clare/Brandon situation as the rest of you seem to. He told her that he'd been excited to come on because she was the Bachelorette and then he couldn't tell her one thing about her (other than her looks) that had made him want to come. Why was he excited that she was the person he was going to meet? Had he watched her on a show? Had he been impressed with something she had said or the way she had acted when she was announced and Chris interviewed her? It was just weird that he couldn't name one thing about her that had impressed him, which makes me think that he was just blowing smoke or thinking that telling her she was pretty was reason enough. And I'm assuming that's what Clare thought, too. I did feel bad for him, because he clearly didn't understand what he was doing wrong and was like a deer in the headlights. She could have been kinder about how she blew him off. I didn't like the ice cold affect and impatience with which she talked to him. I can understand feeling impatient, but I do think that as the lead, you have to show a certain amount of graciousness toward the person you're dealing with unless they are being an absolute jerk, which he wasn't. He just wasn't someone who goes as immediately deep as she likes to, which meant they weren't a good match, but that doesn't make him a bad person, and she treated him like he was. They do usually watch, the season the bachelor or bachelorette is on. The rest I agree with, 100%. |
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Post by MissScarlet on Oct 22, 2020 18:25:53 GMT
In this particular circumstance I agree with Clare.
In many/most seasons, the contestants don't know who the Bachelorette/Bachelor is. We've heard references to this on the show. The contestants talk about it.
If they don't know who the lead is, they can't be expected to research them or even know much if anything about him/her. In a case like that I would have been completely on Brendan's side.
But this season was different. They knew, we knew, everybody knew, who the Bachelorette was going to be long before that first episode. Heck, they even revamped the contestant list well after she was announced. There were months before they went into quarantine. They were home with plenty of access to info.
If it were me, I certainly would have looked up everything I could about the lead, even if I had never watched the whole series at all. I can't imagine anyone not doing that.
It's kind of a no brainer.
Then he was dumb enough to say he was excited & glad it was her. Her asking him why would certainly not have been unexpected.
There was no connection she felt. He hadn't bothered to find out anything about her. She doesn't want to waste her time. Thus, send him home.
I think the fact that all he could say was that she was good looking hurt his case too.
I think she's sick of guys only being interested because of her looks. She's had enough of that kind of superficiallity. The kind who get what they want & then move on to the next hot gal.
He hit on a sore spot.
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Post by babbred on Oct 22, 2020 18:45:55 GMT
In this particular circumstance I agree with Clare. In many/most seasons, the contestants don't know who the Bachelorette/Bachelor is. We've heard references to this on the show. The contestants talk about it. If they don't know who the lead is, they can't be expected to research them or even know much if anything about him/her. In a case like that I would have been completely on Brendan's side. But this season was different. They knew, we knew, everybody knew, who the Bachelorette was going to be long before that first episode. Heck, they even revamped the contestant list well after she was announced. There were months before they went into quarantine. They were home with plenty of access to info. If it were me, I certainly would have looked up everything I could about the lead, even if I had never watched the whole series at all. I can't imagine anyone not doing that. It's kind of a no brainer. Then he was dumb enough to say he was excited & glad it was her. Her asking him why would certainly not have been unexpected. There was no connection she felt. He hadn't bothered to find out anything about her. She doesn't want to waste her time. Thus, send him home.I think the fact that all he could say was that she was good looking hurt his case too. I think she's sick of guys only being interested because of her looks. She's had enough of that kind of superficiallity. The kind who get what they want & then move on to the next hot gal. He hit on a sore spot. That was where my dislike of Clare came in. I mean, for Pete's sake. Would it have been too much effort to deflect him, laugh it off, and then just not give him a rose later at the RC? This whole thing with Clare throwing fits when something happens that she doesn't like is just driving me crazy. Same thing on that group date. Yeah, I would have been miffed that nobody jumped up to spend time with me. But I would maybe have put my hands on my hips and half-jokingly said something about going back to watch Netflix. See if that spurs anybody into action. And then maybe not give some of them roses, depending on if they redeemed themselves when talking to me one-on-one. |
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Post by FannyMare on Oct 22, 2020 19:23:18 GMT
In this particular circumstance I agree with Clare. In many/most seasons, the contestants don't know who the Bachelorette/Bachelor is. We've heard references to this on the show. The contestants talk about it. If they don't know who the lead is, they can't be expected to research them or even know much if anything about him/her. In a case like that I would have been completely on Brendan's side. But this season was different. They knew, we knew, everybody knew, who the Bachelorette was going to be long before that first episode. Heck, they even revamped the contestant list well after she was announced. There were months before they went into quarantine. They were home with plenty of access to info. If it were me, I certainly would have looked up everything I could about the lead, even if I had never watched the whole series at all. I can't imagine anyone not doing that. It's kind of a no brainer. Then he was dumb enough to say he was excited & glad it was her. Her asking him why would certainly not have been unexpected. There was no connection she felt. He hadn't bothered to find out anything about her. She doesn't want to waste her time. Thus, send him home. I think the fact that all he could say was that she was good looking hurt his case too. I think she's sick of guys only being interested because of her looks. She's had enough of that kind of superficiallity. The kind who get what they want & then move on to the next hot gal. He hit on a sore spot. Very good points miss scarlet |
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Post by Critical on Oct 23, 2020 2:57:34 GMT
Taking the Devil's advocate position here and speaking as someone who was pretty cute in her day (although nowhere near as cute as Claire) and got a fair amount of male attention based on looks only.....
I can imagine that Claire has dealt A LOT with guys who only care about what she looks like and express zero interest in who she is as a person. After a while, you get exhausted and suspicious of ANY man who expresses interest. Does he really want to get to know ME or is he after me because I look a certain way? A lot of guys of a certain ilk - and many of this type tend to make their way to this franchise - place a lot of importance on a woman's physical appearance. I can understand why Claire would be wary of a guy who can't say one thing about her other than that he likes how she looks.
It's unusual that the lead of the show would know anything about the guys/girls brought on to date them ahead of filming, but the group almost always knows who the lead is ahead of time. IMO, it's odd that Brandon didn't bother to learn anything about Claire. It's been MONTHS of waiting. Heck, even if I'd been cast just a few days before filming started - which we know is NOT the case - I would have done a quick dive into social media and Google to find out who the person is. Plus, we know that they all got to keep their phones through quarantine, so what on earth was he doing all day? Did he not care who Claire is or did it just not occur to him to be interested? He's taking weeks away (at least) from his life for a person that he doesn't even bother to learn ONE THING about? That tells me that he was more interested in being on TV OR hooking up with a beautiful woman than he was in actually getting to know her.
The guys were in jockstraps, not underwear, hence their bums being blocked too. While it was tasteless, that's certainly not the first time they've had the contestants stripping down, either in a game or just as a matter of course. I remember girls in bikinis skiing)?) down a city street one season. I've seen more girls in bikinis on this show that I have out in the world. Who was the girl whose bikini was so tiny that she had black bars in back AND in front?
Dale's weird little ears. I can't unsee them.
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Post by MissGriss on Oct 23, 2020 3:15:58 GMT
And even if Brandon didn't know anything about Clare or if he didn't have access to the Internet, all he had to do was ask the producers to tell him about her. Sharleen Joynt pointed this out in her recap. When she was first cast for the show, she asked producers some specific questions about Juan Pablo like his religion, what kind of a parent he was, etc. And as the show went on, as she had more questions about him, she asked, and they answered. Clearly, Brandon had no curiosity whatsoever about who Clare was as a person other than being good looking.
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Post by FannyMare on Oct 23, 2020 4:31:26 GMT
And even if Brandon didn't know anything about Clare or if he didn't have access to the Internet, all he had to do was ask the producers to tell him about her. Sharleen Joynt pointed this out in her recap. When she was first cast for the show, she asked producers some specific questions about Juan Pablo like his religion, what kind of a parent he was, etc. And as the show went on, as she had more questions about him, she asked, and they answered. Clearly, Brandon had no curiosity whatsoever about who Clare was as a person other than being good looking. I bet Sharleen wasn't told, he intended to bring his whole family on tv, exploit his child, before hometowns..I can't see the producers spilling all the tea. They like the reactions they get, like Brandon, way too much. Didn't JP owe his child's mother money, she called him a deadbeat dad..  for not paying child support |
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Post by MissGriss on Oct 23, 2020 5:18:08 GMT
And even if Brandon didn't know anything about Clare or if he didn't have access to the Internet, all he had to do was ask the producers to tell him about her. Sharleen Joynt pointed this out in her recap. When she was first cast for the show, she asked producers some specific questions about Juan Pablo like his religion, what kind of a parent he was, etc. And as the show went on, as she had more questions about him, she asked, and they answered. Clearly, Brandon had no curiosity whatsoever about who Clare was as a person other than being good looking. I bet Sharleen wasn't told, he intended to bring his whole family on tv, exploit his child, before hometowns..I can't see the producers spilling all the tea. They like the reactions they get, like Brandon, way too much. Didn't JP owe his child's mother money, she called him a deadbeat dad.. for not paying child support All of that may be true, and Juan Pablo had tons pf faults, but her point still stands that if you're interested in the lead, you'll be curious enough to have questions about them and find ways to get some of those questions answered. |
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Post by acookertv on Oct 23, 2020 10:54:35 GMT
And even if Brandon didn't know anything about Clare or if he didn't have access to the Internet, all he had to do was ask the producers to tell him about her. Sharleen Joynt pointed this out in her recap. When she was first cast for the show, she asked producers some specific questions about Juan Pablo like his religion, what kind of a parent he was, etc. And as the show went on, as she had more questions about him, she asked, and they answered. Clearly, Brandon had no curiosity whatsoever about who Clare was as a person other than being good looking. Or, he was focused on the intent to compliment her beauty, and was thrown off by the question. How often is a person asked a question on the spot, struggles with an answer and then 20 minutes later in his/her mind can figure out exactly what should have been said? I think it's quite possible that Brandon sat down thinking this was going to be his moment to shower her with compliments and make his mark, and didn't think on his feet well before she went in for the kill. Between the number of times throughout the years that a conversation on this show has consisted of "you're so beautiful ... I can't stop thinking of how beautiful you are ..." and how Claire has shown her primary topic of conversation is herself, I think Brandon started out thinking it was a great strategy. |
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Post by FannyMare on Oct 23, 2020 13:07:12 GMT
I bet Sharleen wasn't told, he intended to bring his whole family on tv, exploit his child, before hometowns..I can't see the producers spilling all the tea. They like the reactions they get, like Brandon, way too much. Didn't JP owe his child's mother money, she called him a deadbeat dad.. for not paying child support All of that may be true, and Juan Pablo had tons pf faults, but her point still stands that if you're interested in the lead, you'll be curious enough to have questions about them and find ways to get some of those questions answered. Okay, we'll agree to disagree  . I just don't believe these producers, and Sharleen seems to think she knows more than them.. |
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Post by waywyrd on Oct 23, 2020 13:23:39 GMT
Eh...maybe Brandon's a superficial doofus who thinks that telling a woman she's gorgeous is enough, maybe he did know a little about her but choked when she asked. Either way, I don't think it warranted her jumping all over him like that. She could have handled it with a bit more grace.
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Post by acookertv on Oct 23, 2020 13:39:43 GMT
I think we're seeing that the problem is that Claire made her mark and stood out on the Bachelor by telling Juan Pablo off, therefore she thinks that is her brand. So instead of doing the kind thing and just not giving Brandon a rose at the rose ceremony, she keeps trying to give producers what she believes they want with all these big Claire takes a stand moments.
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Post by FannyMare on Oct 23, 2020 14:22:21 GMT
Eh...maybe Brandon's a superficial doofus who thinks that telling a woman she's gorgeous is enough, maybe he did know a little about her but choked when she asked. Either way, I don't think it warranted her jumping all over him like that. She could have handled it with a bit more grace. I bet in a few weeks, we'll totally forget what Brandon looked like.. |
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Post by acookertv on Oct 23, 2020 15:32:47 GMT
Eh...maybe Brandon's a superficial doofus who thinks that telling a woman she's gorgeous is enough, maybe he did know a little about her but choked when she asked. Either way, I don't think it warranted her jumping all over him like that. She could have handled it with a bit more grace. I bet in a few weeks, we'll totally forget what Brandon looked like.. I already have! |
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Post by babbred on Oct 23, 2020 19:23:46 GMT
I bet in a few weeks, we'll totally forget what Brandon looked like.. I already have! Yep, same here. Now, on to next week's fireworks show. Do we think it's Yousef who finally snaps and tells Clare off? What's the inciting incident that makes all the guys (or at least most of them) walk out? Did they catch Clare and Dale making out/making love somewhere? Did they confront the couple before walking out? I can't wait another week, people!  No spoilers, though. I want to enjoy this implosion when it happens.   |
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Post by FannyMare on Oct 23, 2020 19:50:56 GMT
Yep, same here. Now, on to next week's fireworks show. Do we think it's Yousef who finally snaps and tells Clare off? What's the inciting incident that makes all the guys (or at least most of them) walk out? Did they catch Clare and Dale making out/making love somewhere? Did they confront the couple before walking out? I can't wait another week, people! No spoilers, though. I want to enjoy this implosion when it happens. So, no spoilers , right? I cannot answer your question then.. |
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Was that Yousef who said he wouldn't have stripped down because he didn't want his daughter to be ashamed of him, and that it was classless? Loved that other guy's reaction. "Not even to your shorts?" No, dude. Because Yousef has some personal dignity and, well, class. I haven't read any spoilers, but I would bet bottom dollar that he's the one who tells her off next week. When I saw those previews last week, I sympathized with Clare. Now I'm rooting for whoever tells her the truth. And good for the guys for walking out.
for not paying child support 
. I just don't believe these producers, and Sharleen seems to think she knows more than them..
